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 Post subject: Re: Valley Transfers
PostPosted: Sun May 03, 2020 1:01 pm 
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Posts: 1433
JC64 wrote:
Regarding JFL, It seems like his reason for claiming hardship is a work in progress.


Probably. It's a tough call on these things, but I think that, in the wake of everything that has been happening, the NCAA is going to be super lenient on "hardship waivers." It is what it is....


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 Post subject: Re: Valley Transfers
PostPosted: Mon May 04, 2020 6:28 am 
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Joined: Wed May 15, 2013 6:06 pm
Posts: 999
I can't help just by watching The Last Dance how much of a sea-change there's been in college basketball, especially at the non-high major level. There are so many players who went on to have great NBA careers in the 80s and 90s that did not play their college ball at a traditional college basketball power.

Just to list a few:
Pippen - Central Arkansas
Rodman - SE Oklahoma St.
Ron Harper - Miami (OH)
Joe Dumars - McNeese St.
Rich Mahorn - Hampton
Dan Majerle - Central Michigan
John Starks - 1 year at Oklahoma St. after 3 years at community college
Charles Oakley - Virginia Union
Anthony Mason - Tennessee St.
Jerome Kersey - Longwood
Kevin Duckworth - Eastern Illinois
Bill Cartwright - San Francisco

Heck, I think you could make the case that Barkley was under-recruited going to Auburn. You can't help but wonder if those guys who fell through the cracks in high school would have ended up transferring up to bigger schools if they were coming up now.


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 Post subject: Re: Valley Transfers
PostPosted: Mon May 04, 2020 8:52 am 
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Joined: Wed Nov 07, 2018 10:11 am
Posts: 385
lusuperfan wrote:
I can't help just by watching The Last Dance how much of a sea-change there's been in college basketball, especially at the non-high major level. There are so many players who went on to have great NBA careers in the 80s and 90s that did not play their college ball at a traditional college basketball power.

Just to list a few:
Pippen - Central Arkansas
Rodman - SE Oklahoma St.
Ron Harper - Miami (OH)
Joe Dumars - McNeese St.
Rich Mahorn - Hampton
Dan Majerle - Central Michigan
John Starks - 1 year at Oklahoma St. after 3 years at community college
Charles Oakley - Virginia Union
Anthony Mason - Tennessee St.
Jerome Kersey - Longwood
Kevin Duckworth - Eastern Illinois
Bill Cartwright - San Francisco

Heck, I think you could make the case that Barkley was under-recruited going to Auburn. You can't help but wonder if those guys who fell through the cracks in high school would have ended up transferring up to bigger schools if they were coming up now.


I don't think things have changed that much...
Lillard
McCollum
Siakam
Leonard
Sabonis
Curry
Paul George
Hayward

all went to mid-majors. Obviously there are more but those guys are all all-nba players.


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 Post subject: Re: Valley Transfers
PostPosted: Mon May 04, 2020 10:48 am 
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Joined: Wed May 15, 2013 6:06 pm
Posts: 999
jmiller2794 wrote:
lusuperfan wrote:
I can't help just by watching The Last Dance how much of a sea-change there's been in college basketball, especially at the non-high major level. There are so many players who went on to have great NBA careers in the 80s and 90s that did not play their college ball at a traditional college basketball power.

Just to list a few:
Pippen - Central Arkansas
Rodman - SE Oklahoma St.
Ron Harper - Miami (OH)
Joe Dumars - McNeese St.
Rich Mahorn - Hampton
Dan Majerle - Central Michigan
John Starks - 1 year at Oklahoma St. after 3 years at community college
Charles Oakley - Virginia Union
Anthony Mason - Tennessee St.
Jerome Kersey - Longwood
Kevin Duckworth - Eastern Illinois
Bill Cartwright - San Francisco

Heck, I think you could make the case that Barkley was under-recruited going to Auburn. You can't help but wonder if those guys who fell through the cracks in high school would have ended up transferring up to bigger schools if they were coming up now.


I don't think things have changed that much...
Lillard
McCollum
Siakam
Leonard
Sabonis
Curry
Paul George
Hayward

all went to mid-majors. Obviously there are more but those guys are all all-nba players.

1.) Sabonis counts? Gonzaga is hardly a mid-major anymore, and they certainly don't recruit like one.
2.) Some of those guys were obviously late developers physically (Pippen and Rodman in my list, Curry in jmiller's). Others developed really quickly in college and left early (Kawhi and Hayward). Even those guys had some high-major offers.
3.) I think the big thing is will we see those mid-major players in 5-10 years? If a guy like Liam Robbins makes this list in 5-10 years, he'll be listed as going to Minnesota not Drake. Unfortunately, it seems more and more likely that the days of seeing guys like Lillard and McCollum (4 year star players at mid-majors) might be over.


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 Post subject: Re: Valley Transfers
PostPosted: Mon May 04, 2020 12:22 pm 
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Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2014 7:32 am
Posts: 2296
Missouri State was busy today
5/4/2020 - Missouri State 2020 SG Raphe Ayres (6-5, 195, 2★) signed with Missouri State.
5/4/2020 - Missouri State 2020 PG Skylar Wicks (6-6, 200, 2★) signed with Missouri State.
5/4/2020 - Missouri State 2020 PF Melvyn Ebonkoli (6-8, 202, 2★) signed with Missouri State.
5/4/2020 - Missouri State JUCO C Nic Tata (6-10, -, 2★) signed with Missouri State.
5/4/2020 - Missouri State JUCO SG Demarcus Sharp (6-4, 180, 2★) signed with Missouri State.
5/4/2020 - Missouri State JUCO SF Keaton Hervey (6-7, 187, 3★) signed with Missouri State.
5/4/2020 - Missouri State 2018 C Dawson Carper (7-0, 250, 2★) signed with Missouri State.
with out really looking into these players all you can really say is that overall there is some height here.


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 Post subject: Re: Valley Transfers
PostPosted: Mon May 04, 2020 2:35 pm 
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Joined: Wed Nov 07, 2018 10:11 am
Posts: 385
natetheskate wrote:
Missouri State was busy today
5/4/2020 - Missouri State 2020 SG Raphe Ayres (6-5, 195, 2★) signed with Missouri State.
5/4/2020 - Missouri State 2020 PG Skylar Wicks (6-6, 200, 2★) signed with Missouri State.
5/4/2020 - Missouri State 2020 PF Melvyn Ebonkoli (6-8, 202, 2★) signed with Missouri State.
5/4/2020 - Missouri State JUCO C Nic Tata (6-10, -, 2★) signed with Missouri State.
5/4/2020 - Missouri State JUCO SG Demarcus Sharp (6-4, 180, 2★) signed with Missouri State.
5/4/2020 - Missouri State JUCO SF Keaton Hervey (6-7, 187, 3★) signed with Missouri State.
5/4/2020 - Missouri State 2018 C Dawson Carper (7-0, 250, 2★) signed with Missouri State.
with out really looking into these players all you can really say is that overall there is some height here.


Missouri Net wrote:
Dawson Carper (C, 7-0, 250, Jr., Colorado Springs, Colo., Rampart High, Hawaii)

Carper averaged 6.0 points and 3.9 rebounds per game as a sophomore at the University of Hawaii this season for a 17-13 squad. He started 22-of-28 appearances and scored in double figures four times, including a season-high 20-point outing at Cal Poly for his first double-double. He also converted 73-of-119 field goals (.613). As a freshman, Carper posted 3.0 points and 2.3 rebounds in 26 appearances for an 18-13 Rainbow Warriors team. He converted 33-of-52 (.635) shots as a true freshman and earned a spot on the Big West Commissioner’s Honor Roll. He prepped at Rampart High in his hometown of Colorado Springs, Colo., where he made 69.8 percent of his career field goals to establish a new state record for FG percentage. He posted 19.8 points, 9.8 rebounds and 2.6 blocks per game as a senior while earning all-state first-team honors and leading his team to an 18-7 campaign.


A true 7 footer always gets an eyebrow raise but those stats are hardly imposing. Won't face him till the 2021-22 season though.


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 Post subject: Re: Valley Transfers
PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2020 8:00 am 
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Joined: Wed Nov 07, 2018 10:11 am
Posts: 385
lusuperfan wrote:
jmiller2794 wrote:
lusuperfan wrote:
I can't help just by watching The Last Dance how much of a sea-change there's been in college basketball, especially at the non-high major level. There are so many players who went on to have great NBA careers in the 80s and 90s that did not play their college ball at a traditional college basketball power.

Just to list a few:
Pippen - Central Arkansas
Rodman - SE Oklahoma St.
Ron Harper - Miami (OH)
Joe Dumars - McNeese St.
Rich Mahorn - Hampton
Dan Majerle - Central Michigan
John Starks - 1 year at Oklahoma St. after 3 years at community college
Charles Oakley - Virginia Union
Anthony Mason - Tennessee St.
Jerome Kersey - Longwood
Kevin Duckworth - Eastern Illinois
Bill Cartwright - San Francisco

Heck, I think you could make the case that Barkley was under-recruited going to Auburn. You can't help but wonder if those guys who fell through the cracks in high school would have ended up transferring up to bigger schools if they were coming up now.


I don't think things have changed that much...
Lillard
McCollum
Siakam
Leonard
Sabonis
Curry
Paul George
Hayward

all went to mid-majors. Obviously there are more but those guys are all all-nba players.

1.) Sabonis counts? Gonzaga is hardly a mid-major anymore, and they certainly don't recruit like one.
2.) Some of those guys were obviously late developers physically (Pippen and Rodman in my list, Curry in jmiller's). Others developed really quickly in college and left early (Kawhi and Hayward). Even those guys had some high-major offers.
3.) I think the big thing is will we see those mid-major players in 5-10 years? If a guy like Liam Robbins makes this list in 5-10 years, he'll be listed as going to Minnesota not Drake. Unfortunately, it seems more and more likely that the days of seeing guys like Lillard and McCollum (4 year star players at mid-majors) might be over.



Does anyone have 4 year star players anymore? At least guys who are 1st or 2nd round draft potential? I think that's the big change since the 90s, not a lack of mid-major presence in the league. (Also add Ja Morant to the list)


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 Post subject: Re: Valley Transfers
PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2020 8:22 am 
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Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2014 7:32 am
Posts: 2296
7 footers are often projects..who take a while to bake..Robbins from Drake a good example......But I call this the Krutwig effect...almost every team in the Conference brought in a new center last year...My thought was that they all felt that if they did not improve at the 5 spot LU would just keep running away.....I also saw teams adapt different ways to guard Krut.....I think he was the focus of a lot of attention.....How many players have we had that teams have had to plan for? I am thinking LaRue way back,,,,ALfredrick,,,,maybe Milt......Krut has really been something,,,,,and he was all shinny right out of the box!


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 Post subject: Re: Valley Transfers
PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2020 9:06 am 
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Joined: Mon May 06, 2013 12:39 pm
Posts: 2502
natetheskate wrote:
7 footers are often projects..who take a while to bake..Robbins from Drake a good example......But I call this the Krutwig effect...almost every team in the Conference brought in a new center last year...My thought was that they all felt that if they did not improve at the 5 spot LU would just keep running away.....I also saw teams adapt different ways to guard Krut.....I think he was the focus of a lot of attention.....How many players have we had that teams have had to plan for? I am thinking LaRue way back,,,,ALfredrick,,,,maybe Milt......Krut has really been something,,,,,and he was all shinny right out of the box!


Someone posted this in another thread, but I'd really like to see more offensive sets where Krut sits down low and facilitates there (either dishing or going up with it). This is more similar to how we used him his freshman year. I think we should be able to do it more this year when we pair him with four offensive threats that can shoot from deep or drive/dish (e.g., Krut with Lucas/Tate/Kennedy/Clemons). This isn't to say that we should eliminate him working the high post altogether--just mix it up more.


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 Post subject: Re: Valley Transfers
PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2020 11:11 am 
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Joined: Mon Sep 23, 2013 1:02 pm
Posts: 1433
goramblers2011 wrote:
natetheskate wrote:
7 footers are often projects..who take a while to bake..Robbins from Drake a good example......But I call this the Krutwig effect...almost every team in the Conference brought in a new center last year...My thought was that they all felt that if they did not improve at the 5 spot LU would just keep running away.....I also saw teams adapt different ways to guard Krut.....I think he was the focus of a lot of attention.....How many players have we had that teams have had to plan for? I am thinking LaRue way back,,,,ALfredrick,,,,maybe Milt......Krut has really been something,,,,,and he was all shinny right out of the box!


Someone posted this in another thread, but I'd really like to see more offensive sets where Krut sits down low and facilitates there (either dishing or going up with it). This is more similar to how we used him his freshman year. I think we should be able to do it more this year when we pair him with four offensive threats that can shoot from deep or drive/dish (e.g., Krut with Lucas/Tate/Kennedy/Clemons). This isn't to say that we should eliminate him working the high post altogether--just mix it up more.


I would like to see him work more from the low post, unless he develops an efficient mid-range shot from just behind the foul line. If he can do that, it will really open things up for us. Last year teams were daring him to take that shot. If he starts taking it and is connecting — look out! He would be impossible to guard if he had the option to thread the ball to a cutter, drive OR shoot!


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